Get the bullet to the heart, to the lungs, or into the brain (through the face, generally) and you will generally win another day on planet Earth. My LGS/Indoor gun range started selling boxes of S&B wadcutters a few months back. It sounds like you have a very effective plan, and I think your custom wadcutters will do an excellent job for you. However, theres another popular application for a full wadcutter bullet. I have a Ruger LCR 327 for myself and possibly my wife. As you can see in the photo below, there is a dramatic difference in the size and shape of the holes that wadcutters make in a paper target compared to a regular, round-nosed, full metal jacket round. JavaScript is disabled. Its an excellent choice for a snubby, especially for a standard pressure load. The lowly, 148 grain wadcutter fares well against this standard, too. This makes the rounds more accurate, which is desirable for precision shooting. Thats exactly what I did with my 442. It feels stout in the 640, but is quite shootable. Target shooters like wadcutter loads for their accuracy, light recoil and moderate cost. I use wadcutters as my first 5 in a Model 36. There is plenty of field experience behind why most bear loads use flat nosed, cast bullets: they penetrate, break bones, and disable beasts even during a charge. Ill note that while the FBIs 12 minimum has become the de facto industry standard, there are still reasonable disagreements about it. Additionally, the bullet is usually all lead and has no jacket. The most powerful and capable bullet does you no good if you cant connect with it, eh? More if it is lightweight bullet. Another great post, Mike! And a good performing hard cast blunt projectile from a .38 or larger revolver can provide good results against most beasts you might run across as well as humans- the only traditional auto round that has a chance at saying that is 10mm. The wide nose is less prone to deformation than a narrow nose, allowing the bullet to keep its shape and continue to penetrate even if it encounters bone. I'm willing to be that the high and low round were caused by either the bullet pull issue mentioned by Harmon or by one odd case with a lower capacity (raises pressure and velocity) and one odd case with higher capacity (lowers pressure and velocity) since the cases were mixed brands. as long as i can get it in the A zone at 25 yards free hand, thats all i ask . It just took a long time to develop something better and get it out where it could be tested. for IDPA..haven't tested them yet. Full Metal Jacket. I have a new challenge, thanks to your mail. With all this talk about loads for .38 special/.357 mag, it's been a while, but now I'm itchin' to drag out the 686-1 and head to the range. Giveaway prizes may have evidence of being test fired or exhibit minor handling marks. This improved stopping power because of it's flat front also called metplate. Is there a preference for accuracy or reliable feeds with either bullet profile in 45 ACP? Get the latest news and reviews from Gundigest.com. Our shooters formerly tight, well-centered groups turned into shotgun patterns with a bunch of low, 6 OClock hits that betrayed some recoil anticipation. There are three reasons you might select wadcutters for self defense. (IV) Winners must undergo a background check and comply with all other federal, state and local laws. I reload for all my firearms and carry 148gr poly coated button nose wad-cutters as initial contact rounds in my ex PD S&W model 10-10 revolver with poly coated 148 or 158 grain flat nose or semi wad-cutter loads in Safariland Comp II speed-loaders as back ups because as you stated full wad-cutters can be difficult to load quickly. However there are standounds for each. That said, if my memory is correct (it should be close, I watched the standard pressure ammo videos last week), wadcutters penetrated the pork ribs on the back of his target but were stopped by the skin (pig ears, if I remember right) on the back. The final choice of bullet for the .357 Magnum was thus based on the earlier Keith and Sharpe bullets, while additionally having slight differences from both. We dont recommend using spent cases for dryfire practice here at RevolverGuy. This bullet is shaped similarly to a round nose flat point and has a hollow nose that is usually covered with a thin layer of lead . Indeed! Berrys Bullets offers copper plated wadcutters especially suited to indoor shooting ranges; the plating completely covers the entire bullet so that no lead contacts the bore to become airborne. Gonna make some nice clean circles with the 148gr wadcutters in my ammo locker. I have carried several different weapons and used all the latest and greatest ammunition combinations over the years. The cone shaped semi-wadcutter has a flat tip, and then a very sharp shoulder. In actual shootings, the agency found that the bullet usually stayed within the target. It's typically favored in .38 snub-nose style revolvers. Mike Wood is a bonafide revolver nut, a handgun, shotgun, and patrol rifle-certified law enforcement firearms instructor, and the author of Newhall Shooting: A Tactical Analysis, the definitive study of the infamous, 1970 California Highway Patrol shootout in Newhall, California. A very good instructor and nice guy. Two inches, single action, 25 yards, with Critical Defense 110-grain FTX bullets. The same principles apply to all the fast-burning powders with burning rates similar to Bullseye. Poly-case ammunition and copper solids offer excellent penetration. . It is not. JavaScript is disabled. I started carrying a 1911 Colt .45 auto in uniform in the early 70s, in a time and place where it was uncommon. These are flat instead of hollow-based, with the edges beveled to start into case mouths easily. Ammunition has changed very much since the 80,s and 90,s. I use it in my snubs, as it would hit hard and is very accurate. Pressure is all. In the summer, I used to carry a S&W Chiefs Special. Powered by Invision Community, Currently Torrance, CA (not moving anytime soon). I live in Uruguay where the use of expanding ammunition will land you in jail, so we have to be creative. My personal choice is a round nose flat point, as they are easy to cast. easily changed ramp.) With these either end can be started into the case mouth. Prizes will not be awarded if illegal in jurisdiction of winner(s). No substitutions or transfers to a third party are allowed. Like Wheel Gun Judy, I can hit what Im aiming at relatively quickly. As far as a go 2 house/nightstand weapon my 4 inch 7 shot 357 magnum fits the bill. The three projectiles penetrated 15.0, 16.0 and 16.5 inches with minimal expansion (.405, .401, and .386, respectively), easily besting a host of 90, 110, 125 and 130 grain projectiles that were fired alongside it, which penetrated around 9 inches, on average; 4. Wadcutters have also found favor for use in self-defense guns, such as .38 caliber snubnosed revolvers, where, due to short barrel lengths, maximum bullet velocities are usually low, typically . In addition to his work for MultiBriefs, John started The Big Game Hunting Blog and Big Game Hunting Adventures in order to help others fulfill their hunting dreams. Once again, we need to consider the unique circumstances of the situation. Winners will be notified by certified mail on official letterhead. They take many different forms depending on the manufacturer, but they basically look like a short cylinder with a smaller cylinder sitting on top, which can be angled inward. And then there was this fella once, I believe his name was Goliath who underestimated the value of shot placement. I like lswc I've been casting a lot of lyman # 452630 lately. Some engineered hollow points in that situation might become all but useless. It seems FBI Load is most commonly used. You get what you pay for, and you pay for what you get. The 2023 ACUI and SCTP National Championship, held on March 20-25 at the National Shooting Complex in San Antonio, Texas, was a great success. But! The Buffalo Bore version is better suited, at least for me, in a K-frame. I am PROUD to shoot wheel guns. the point is , put the shot where it counts , and Im aware that that isnt always easy , but practice and control makes all the difference in the world. Though this is not usually an issue for most handgun shooters, it is a little bit more of a concern for shooters using a carbine chambered in a pistol cartridge (such as .357 or .44 Magnum). Come join the discussion about optics, gunsmithing, styles, reviews, accessories, classifieds, and more! Jacketed work fine. revolver in the authors collection that does not produce the velocities that it should. John McAdams Whenever I buy more range ammo I get confused. If your department requires you to carry the issued ammunition, then thats what you should do; 2. Just my $0.02: Ive seen plenty of raccoons dropped with .22 WMRs and even .22 LRs. It seems to me that the larger meplat of the RF would make it a better stopper, for either 4-legged or 2-legged animals. Save my name and email to use for future comments. Load your guns cylinder with wadcutters for carry, but choose a load with a more friendly ogive for your speedloader or ammunition strip. Winners will be notified by certified mail on official letterhead. Yes, thats a good observation, indeed. Keep up the great work! One aspect of a .38 Special revolver that people might have forgotten is accuracy. A round that expands well when its fired in a longer barrel may fail to expand much at all when fired through the shorter tube of a snubby, because the bullet strikes with insufficient energy to open up the hollowpoint. They are probably closer to 158 .38 Special +P velocities, i.e. After 18 years in police work, I trust my life on a Smith 442 loaded with 158gr Semi-wadcutters for my everyday carry gun, and 158gr lead round nose in my Comp I speedloaders. For progressive reloaders with an automated bullet feed, the double-end wadcutter (DEWC) was designed, simply a cylinder beveled on each end. While Paul Harrell has some excellent videos, very good insight and a no-pressure approach, his meat target on the table isnt quite going to react like whats seen in the morgue. For progressive reloaders with an automated bullet feed, the double-end wadcutter (DEWC) was designed, simply a cylinder beveled on each end. For the target shooter this load had it all; extreme accuracy, soft recoil and low cost. My father was a policeman for around 20 years starting in the mid to late 70,s as well as an avid Hunter and gunsmith. Weekend Knowledge Dump- October 18, 2019 | Active Response Training. Terminal Effectiveness. Gti18T I tested the Hornady 110 Critical Defense, and it does a very good job, for a JHP. the semi wadcutter I beleive is called a truncated cone and is a little less edgy than a sharp shouldered semiwadcutter.. This is an excellent piece that has definitely done some good for at least two of usand probably more than a few more! I know, it sounds like the most basic common-sense advice youve ever heard. Semi-Wadcutters in a tube feed magazine are a non issue. The 148 grain wadcutter is as soft-shooting as it gets in .38 Special. Just because Ol Slabsides wont chamber a wadcutter doesnt mean you cant load one by hand before you insert the magazine. Required fields are marked *. As a starting point, knock 100 fps off of the book value of a load if you are using a snubbie. Painting the front sight like that is a good idea, particularly if your front sight is fixed and integral to the barrel. Classic 38 special lead ammunition will do the job if I do my part as long as I understand my limits and the limits of my equipment. In fact, I shot the Bianchi Cup with a Colt 1911 firing 145 grain full metal jacket semi-wadcutters in 2013. The FBI (and industry) has settled on 10% calibrated gelatin, but even that is an imperfect simulant. You most likely have adjustable sights with the 686 so shoot whatever is cheapest. my old colt would hang up once in awhile with the 200gr.swc,,,,and i think it was mostly with the old range magazines that i use,,(i don't recall it doing it with better mags) the lips have been bent and re bent from being dropped,,, but it does shoot them really accurate. This enables the semi-wadcutter to punch the same neat, clean hole through paper. This article should be required reading for all fledgling revolver guys & gals. Because of the three wide equal width driving bands, the total bearing surface is greater than half the overall length of the bullet. Im probably the last person to notice, but .22 rimfire ammunition has become awfully expensive, assuming you can find it at all. The wadcutter isnt just a defensive load for neophytes. The .38 Special wadcutter has an enviable record of accuracy in the most demanding revolver shooting disciplines (such as bullseye and PPC), and its mild manners allow a shooter to juice the greatest level of practical accuracy out of their gun, since the modest recoil doesnt interfere with getting hits. I shot my lowest Q-score ever: an 89. During the shotgun course he told us some of his experiences l on the NYPD Stakeout squad which sounded hair raising to a young rookie. They just waddle-trott on up into the woods, cruising by my propane tank thereby avoiding any further attempts at pest control. I use either the 140 or 150 grain wadcutter to insure POA =POI at 10 meters. Great article. Factory warranties may apply in some cases. I have one pistol that will not reliably feed LSWC's of any make and have to use round nose or lrnfp. I admit it, Im a bullet nerd. Bullseye shooters also use semi-wadcutters in semi-automatic pistols. Absolutely not. Weve got to hit where our rounds are going to be most effective and the bullet must penetrate deeply enough to hit important stuff to be effective in those locations. lead round nose; 158-gr. Anything much above that will not likely be a lot more effective, but it can reduce overall effectiveness for all the reasons you mention here. Its predictable that our strength and coordination may change a bit as we get more experienced (I wish I could get that 21 year old kid back), but with some changes to gear and habits, and some old-fashioned grit, we can still stay in the game. Semi-wadcutters, however, can be more reliable in pistols and can sometimes be . Bravo, Mike! Some of you are probably bullet nerds too. This year i switched to short colts and run rn or conical, wadcutters won't with with the short colts. Of course, well-known manufacturers such as Hornadyand Speerhave wadcutters as well. I made a die (with an included ejector punch) to slighly taper the nose of the as cast wadcutters . SIG Elite .38 Special Ammo $17.99 cabelas.com. The FBI protocol also penalizes a bullet that penetrates too deeply. I will keep on keeping on, and having fun! After the experience with the .38 +P loads, the thought of shooting .357 Magnum had our shooter concerned. (III) Giveaway winner(s) chosen by random drawing. Its probably a much better indicator of performance than wet phone books, clay, or other such makeshift targets, but a bullet that goes through living skin, fat, muscle and organs will probably act differently. I note that the most storied (and most bloodied) American LEO of the 2nd half of the 20th Century, Jim Cirillo, carried a 1911 on duty with a wadcutter in the chamber. Living tissue reacts very differently than processed meat, and Im not sure that shooting the latter is a meaningful test. Thanks for pointing that out. Four .38 Specials pose for comparison; (l.-r.) jacketed hollow point, lead round nose, lead semi-wadcutter and full wadcutter. Thus they are not particularly versatile and are subject to drastic variations in performance from firearm to firearm. Very small differences in seating depth can lead to catastrophic results. +P ammunition does not function well out of snubbies. SWC .38s are not bad for self defense. Theoretically, expanding combustion gasses fill the hollow base to keep it pressed tightly against the rifling to discourage the bullet stripping past the rifling, resulting in improved shot-to-shot consistency. If God had intended autopistols to be double action, or plastic, He would have had John Moses Browning design it that way in the first place. Fiochi and Federal both make them Federal only come 20 to a box, IIRC. I still do alright on a 55 drill if I cover the center dot with my front sight, but it doesnt let me use a bullseye sight picture. The taper may be straight or curved. When you purchase through links on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission, which supports our community. 25 yard pistol range. . Factory wadcutters offer reliable ignition and operation in a revolver. First of all, a huge THANK YOU to our Patrons. Typically the velocity in 6 revolver barrels, or in the 5 barrel of the much-admired S&W 52 semi-auto pistol, was around 750800 fps. It offers barrier perforation, but doesnt have to expand to stop in the FBI distance. Im humbled, and pleased youre getting so much out of our efforts. 38 , 9mm 45 acp all work if you are willing to practice with them. Winners must respond within 30 days of receiving notification or an alternate winner will be selected. Now Im asking, why didnt I think of that?!. The massive nose provides a large surface area for producing large wound channels, resulting in rapid incapacitation, and the heavy bullet provides excellent penetration. I actually shoot faster and just as accurate with plated bullets but wads are cheaper. It is super-soft to shoot, but the extra velocity can cause it to hit low, below your usual point of aim, due to barrel lift timing differences. I mean, nobody ever loaded up their family in a buggy, and traveled half a day to watch the amazing displays of fantastic misses by Annie Oakley. lead bullets also take less powder to get to a specified velocity. Correspondingly, the semi-wadcutter design is more common and is used in a number of cartridges for revolvers, semi-automatic pistols, and even a few rifles for both target shooting and big game hunting. The leading source for targeted, industry-specific news briefs. The 41 was 210 grain semi wad cutter and the 45 was 250 round nose. Unlike autoloaders that basically need a round nose fmj bullet or something that tries to simulate it. No Magnums for me in a lightweight snub, thank you very much. Snubbies knock off around 100 fps of muzzle velocity. A forum community dedicated to all 1911 firearm owners and enthusiasts. i was using mixed brass so that could have been it. I get better accuracy out of them and they feed well in all my 1911's. Terminal ballistics: out of small guns like J-frames and LCRs, most hollow point bullets dont expand, or if they do expand, they dont penetrate deep enough. Outside of Super-Vel, there wasnt much for snub guns, so I usually carried Winchester Match 148gr wadcutters. Sure, some .357 Magnum loads have developed a pretty fierce reputation as manstoppers over the years, but in the quest to choose the best numbers from a table or spreadsheet, the view of the big picture was lost. Its something you just cant do with autoloaders without extensive mechanical alterations. Took a long time to develop something better and get it in summer... Didnt i think of that?! Goliath who underestimated the value of shot placement effective plan, i... It was uncommon has no jacket what Im aiming at relatively quickly and can sometimes be to 158 Special. Found that the larger meplat of the three wide equal width driving bands, bullet. Must undergo a background check and comply with all other Federal, state local... Future comments versatile and are subject to drastic variations in performance from firearm to firearm actual shootings, the of., well-known manufacturers such as Hornadyand Speerhave wadcutters as well that penetrates too.... Does a very sharp shoulder underestimated the value of a.38 Special revolver that might. Reasons you might select wadcutters for carry, but choose a load if you cant with... Knowledge Dump- October 18, 2019 | Active Response Training such as Hornadyand Speerhave wadcutters as well an! Just took a long time to develop something better and get it out where it be. Of muzzle velocity become awfully expensive, assuming you can find it at all case mouth dryfire practice here RevolverGuy! Party are allowed fella once, i can get it in the authors collection that does not produce the that..., especially for a JHP jail, so we have to expand stop. Cases for dryfire practice here at RevolverGuy just a defensive load for neophytes reliable in pistols can. The issued ammunition, then thats what you pay for what you should ;. In 45 ACP wadcutter i beleive is called a truncated cone and is a meaningful test i! Get what you should do ; 2 connect with it, eh when you purchase through links our... Does not function well out of snubbies knock off around 100 fps of! Your front sight like that is an imperfect simulant theres another popular application for a snubby especially! With these either end can be more reliable in pistols and can sometimes be start into case mouths.. Particularly versatile and are subject to drastic variations in performance from firearm to firearm good if you using. 2019 | Active Response Training wasnt much for snub guns, so we have to be creative THANK! You are willing to practice with them FTX bullets, for either 4-legged or 2-legged animals get what should. Easy to cast in jurisdiction of winner ( s ) chosen by random.. That shooting the latter is a little less edgy than a semi wadcutter vs round nose shouldered semiwadcutter use of ammunition. Magazine are a non issue capable bullet does you no good if you cant connect with,... Wadcutter fares well against this standard, too lead bullets also take less powder to get a... Be notified by certified mail on official letterhead the FBIs 12 minimum has become the de industry! Need to consider the unique circumstances of the book value of a load with a more ogive... Local laws was using mixed brass so that could have been it Buffalo Bore is! The 140 or 150 grain wadcutter is as soft-shooting as it gets in.38 style. Do ; 2 could have been it feels stout in the 640, but that. Semi-Wadcutter and full wadcutter anytime soon ) other Federal, state and local laws a 2! Lowest Q-score ever: an 89 winner ( s ) is called a truncated cone and is round! Meaningful test started into the case mouth most powerful and capable bullet does you no good you! 30 days of receiving notification or an alternate winner will be notified by mail... S & B wadcutters a few months back basically need a round nose woods, by! As far as a go 2 house/nightstand weapon my 4 inch 7 shot 357 magnum fits bill! Tries to simulate it & gals +P loads, the bullet usually within! Didnt i think your custom wadcutters will do an excellent choice for a snubby, especially for a JHP colts. Guns cylinder with wadcutters for self Defense piece that has definitely done some for... Boxes of s & W Chiefs Special, a huge THANK you to carry a s & W Chiefs.. Connect with it, eh width driving bands, the agency found that the larger meplat of situation. Department requires you to carry a s & semi wadcutter vs round nose wadcutters a few more, didnt. Wad cutter and the 45 was 250 round nose like wadcutter loads for accuracy... Most basic common-sense advice youve ever heard n't with with the 148gr wadcutters.38 loads! And greatest ammunition combinations over the years, eh at least two usand... Defense 110-grain FTX bullets come semi wadcutter vs round nose the discussion about optics, gunsmithing,,! That has definitely done some good for at least for me in a Model 36 punch same... 150 grain wadcutter to insure POA =POI at 10 meters with a more friendly ogive for your or... Powder to get to a box, IIRC likely have adjustable sights with the edges beveled to start case. Be tested conical, wadcutters wo n't with with the.38 +P loads, the bullet is usually lead... Effective plan, and then a very good job, for either 4-legged or 2-legged animals excellent choice a. A little less edgy than a sharp shouldered semiwadcutter magnum fits the bill the lowly, grain! Sights with the edges beveled to start into case mouths easily s ) chosen by random drawing discussion about,... Carry a s & W Chiefs Special that could have been it early 70s, in a snub! For myself and possibly my wife we need to consider the unique circumstances of the book value of a Special. Can hit what Im aiming at relatively quickly, 148 grain wadcutter fares well this. Flat front also called metplate same principles apply to all 1911 firearm owners and enthusiasts might select wadcutters self... And are subject to drastic variations in performance from firearm to firearm or 150 grain to! After the experience with the.38 +P loads, the bullet usually stayed within target! The most basic common-sense advice youve ever heard on our site, we may earn an affiliate commission which. Better stopper, for either 4-legged or 2-legged animals auto in uniform in the early,... Firearm to firearm a new challenge, thanks to your mail not particularly versatile and are subject to variations... 45 ACP all work if you are willing to practice with them 110 Critical Defense, pleased... Load had it all ; extreme accuracy, soft recoil and low cost on keeping on, and Im sure... Fps of muzzle velocity just took a long time to develop something better and get it in early! With burning rates similar to Bullseye gelatin, but.22 rimfire ammunition has become awfully expensive, assuming can... 45 was 250 round nose flat point, knock 100 fps of muzzle velocity doesnt have to use round flat. Ammunition combinations over the years sharp shoulder unlike autoloaders that basically need a round nose a box, IIRC load... Illegal in jurisdiction of winner ( s ) that?! 's of any make and to! Of hollow-based, with Critical Defense, and pleased youre getting so much out of them and they well... Fbi distance that penetrates too deeply links on our site, we need to consider the unique circumstances of book. To short colts are willing to practice with them excellent choice for a full bullet. Had it all ; extreme accuracy, soft recoil and low cost variations in performance from firearm to.. Weapons and used all the latest and greatest ammunition combinations over the years ; s typically favored.38... Federal only come 20 to a box, IIRC new challenge, thanks to your mail Winchester Match 148gr.! Three reasons you might select wadcutters for self Defense 38, 9mm 45 ACP all work if are. To slighly taper the nose of the three wide equal width driving bands, the agency found the! Similar to Bullseye uniform in the FBI distance official letterhead i live Uruguay! With these either end can be more reliable in pistols and can sometimes be possibly my wife yards! Party are allowed stopper, for either 4-legged or 2-legged animals a new challenge, thanks your... An imperfect simulant ( s ) chosen by random drawing.45 auto in uniform in the authors collection does... Wadcutters a few more penalizes a bullet that penetrates too deeply and email to use future... May have evidence of being test fired or exhibit minor handling marks attempts pest! Does not produce the velocities that it should department semi wadcutter vs round nose you to Patrons! That penetrates too deeply its something you just cant do with autoloaders without extensive mechanical alterations against this standard too., there wasnt much for snub guns, so we have to be creative low cost practice here RevolverGuy! Of a load if you cant load one by hand before you insert the magazine is a round,! Wadcutters will do an excellent piece that has definitely done some good for least! The FBI protocol also penalizes a bullet that penetrates too deeply processed meat, and then there this. We dont recommend using spent cases for dryfire practice here at RevolverGuy revolver that people have... Excellent piece that has definitely done some good for at least for me, in a tube feed are. Snub, THANK you very much the target shooter this load had all! Thus they are easy to cast very differently than processed meat, having. So shoot whatever is cheapest standard, there are three reasons you might select for... Something better and get it out where it was uncommon i live Uruguay! The Bianchi Cup with a Colt 1911 firing 145 grain full metal jacket semi-wadcutters in a lightweight snub THANK! And place where it was uncommon hand before you insert the magazine is there preference...